Author Topic: Why I'm voting Democrat...  (Read 4572 times)

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Offline z_randy

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Re: Why I'm voting Democrat...
« Reply #30 on: October 29, 2008, 12:52:39 PM »
well we can just keep going along the way we have been going and keep spending what we don't have, keep cutting taxes for the wealthy, give a 1% tax cut to the middle class, raise the national debt, and wait until the democrats finally do get back in power and have to raise taxes to pay off what the republicans have given away the last 8 years.  Then they can say look see it the democrats fault, that taxes are high, forget that we spent 11,000,000,000,000 dollars.
But isn't that exactly what Obama's plan entails?  Adding something like a trillion dollars in government programs (spending money we don't have) and giving tax cuts to 95% of the country?  So what you are saying is when Obama wins he will have to raise taxes?  At least that is one reason (you asked in another thread) to vote McCain.  he wants to put a spending freeze on everything but Defense, Veterans & entitlements. (have to admit not sure what entitlements are)



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Offline MnMDad

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Re: Why I'm voting Democrat...
« Reply #31 on: October 29, 2008, 01:07:26 PM »
It does not matter who gets in there taxes will go up.  There are only 2 certainties in life, death and taxes.  How is McCain going to put a freeze on spending?  Obama at least admits he is going to tax the top 5% more.  If loop holes are closed then there will be more money not less.  How many people making 30k a year does it take to equal 1 person making 5 million a year?  166 peple.  John McCain thinks the middle class make 5 million a year.  How out of touch is he?  Someone will raise taxes, but who is going to get the tax hike is the issue.

Offline MnMDad

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Re: Why I'm voting Democrat...
« Reply #32 on: October 29, 2008, 01:11:23 PM »
Oh yeah and McCain is going to tax your health care...not bad for those who don't have to pay for it, but would be a problem for us that do need to pay for it.

Offline z_randy

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Re: Why I'm voting Democrat...
« Reply #33 on: October 29, 2008, 01:20:44 PM »
That's my point.  Everyone here is quoting that he will not raise taxes on anyone not making X amount of money.  So why worry I'm getting a tax break.  BS taxes will go up.  Those top 5% didn't get there by being stupid. (well maybe some did) There is no way to provide all the services they want to provide and magically produce the money.  It's all talk and it scares me how many people have bought into it.
As far as the McCain idea to let you find your own insurance I am Ok with that but $%K isn't going to cut it and TAXING that is just wrong



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Offline MnMDad

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Re: Why I'm voting Democrat...
« Reply #34 on: October 29, 2008, 03:13:25 PM »
For the most part the top 2% were born into it, on the backs of the worker, and the tax breaks of the already rich.  When was the last time someone was president that didn't come from money or power?  It's time that someone who wins the presidency gets a raise from what they are making, that is why I am putting my name in for president.  My plan calls for 10% flat tax on everyone, including corporations.  A withdrawal from Iraq, and getting the rest of the world to like us again.  End Corporate welfare. 
« Last Edit: October 29, 2008, 03:17:45 PM by MnMDad »

ToddS

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Re: Why I'm voting Democrat...
« Reply #35 on: October 29, 2008, 03:34:29 PM »
For the most part the top 2% were born into it, on the backs of the worker, and the tax breaks of the already rich.  When was the last time someone was president that didn't come from money or power?  It's time that someone who wins the presidency gets a raise from what they are making, that is why I am putting my name in for president.  My plan calls for 10% flat tax on everyone, including corporations.  A withdrawal from Iraq, and getting the rest of the world to like us again.  End Corporate welfare. 

Last time I checked no one was forced into working for the "top 2%" so why is it so bad to create a sucessful company?  Please explain how you tax a corporation.  Individuals pay taxes not corporations.  When taxes are raised on corporations 1 of 3 things happen. 1 Prices are raised on the consumer. 2  Jobs are cut 3 Pay cuts and the owner is not going to cut his pay.  So who gets hurt?  In all 3 situations the individual gets hurt.

Why exactly does the rest of the rest of the world need to like us? 

Offline MnMDad

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Re: Why I'm voting Democrat...
« Reply #36 on: October 29, 2008, 03:40:27 PM »
Corporations do pay taxes, well maybe they don't because of loop holes in our failed tax system, but they are supposed to.  1 prices get raised anyway as a way for stock holders to make more when a company is selling less.  2 Jobs are cut for a variety of reasons, not just because or taxes.  3 whats the point in 3, pay is getting cut and the govt is bailing out the companies that are laying off.   If the rest of the world is with us, then they are not against us.

Vote MnMDad '08
« Last Edit: October 29, 2008, 03:42:27 PM by MnMDad »

ToddS

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Re: Why I'm voting Democrat...
« Reply #37 on: October 29, 2008, 06:23:37 PM »
Corporations do pay taxes, well maybe they don't because of loop holes in our failed tax system, but they are supposed to.  1 prices get raised anyway as a way for stock holders to make more when a company is selling less.  2 Jobs are cut for a variety of reasons, not just because or taxes.  3 whats the point in 3, pay is getting cut and the govt is bailing out the companies that are laying off.   If the rest of the world is with us, then they are not against us.

Vote MnMDad '08

I never said that those 3 items were done only when taxes were raised.  What I was trying to prove is that corporations do not pay taxes nor will they ever.  Businesses exist for 1 reason only and that is to make money.  It costs money to run a business.  The goal is to bring in more money than you spend.  When the cost of doing business goes up (Increasing taxes increases the cost of business)  the owner or board has to make a decision on how to absorb that cost. 

They can choose to cut people's pay and since the owner or board own the business they will cut their pay last (That is their right since they own the business). So the individual worker gets to pay the taxes through lower wages.  Say the owner is a great person and he does decide to cut his own pay again an individual is paying the tax.

They can choose to lay people off.  Again the board or owner are not going to lay themselves off chances are the individual worker will be the one gone.  So he is paying the tax by being jobless.

The company could cut costs which affects the companies that a business deals with or the quality to the individual consumer. 

Another option is that the owner could decide it is not worth the time and effort and just close up shop and everyone loses.

The company could also raise thier prices so now the consumer is paying the taxes.  So there is no way to make corporations pay taxes because a corporation is a shell for an individual or group of individuals. 

Offline joey791

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Re: Why I'm voting Democrat...
« Reply #38 on: October 29, 2008, 06:47:23 PM »
That whole thing was a staged affair by Dem's to show solidarity, it was never going to happen.  Funding was going to go to the military.   So that is just more right wing redirect.



Yeah but when you decide to make a stand even implying in anyway that you would take from our soldiers, it shows what a worthless leader you really are, they can rot. X-(

Offline joey791

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Re: Why I'm voting Democrat...
« Reply #39 on: October 29, 2008, 06:52:07 PM »
It does not matter who gets in there taxes will go up.  There are only 2 certainties in life, death and taxes.  How is McCain going to put a freeze on spending?  Obama at least admits he is going to tax the top 5% more.  If loop holes are closed then there will be more money not less.  How many people making 30k a year does it take to equal 1 person making 5 million a year?  166 peple.  John McCain thinks the middle class make 5 million a year.  How out of touch is he?  Someone will raise taxes, but who is going to get the tax hike is the issue.

I guess this is what aggravates me the most and often wonder why people dont understand. If you tax the top 5% more they are just going to find more tax shelters and offshore accounts to hide their money, it will affect them in no way, shape, or form, but the working man will pick up the increase through, lost wages, lost jobs, and lost benefits. No one in their right mind can tell me that you can tax someone with that amount of funds and they are just going to take it on the chin and say "you know I need to pay more than everyone else".

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Re: Why I'm voting Democrat...
« Reply #40 on: October 29, 2008, 09:30:21 PM »
In 2006 the bottom 50% of income earners paid 3% of the income taxes.  So who does not pay their fair share?  What is even more amazing is that when the "Evil greedy bastard" Bush took office they were paying 4% of taxes.  So this horrible horrible poor hating President managed to reduce the unfortunates tax burden by 25% and what does he get?  Sounds like the Bush tax cuts did terrible things and I would hate to see anyone want to continue that.


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